re:Oh by the way

[K Bacon <s340090@student.uq.edu.au>]

At 19:44 25/10/97 -0400, you wrote:

>My point and I believe Lane's is that 'yes understand the song as you wish
>to but the original meaning/the aritist's meaning is not how you (yourself)
>have interpreted it (In our opinion)'

I never said that listeners' interpretations are 'original'
interpretations... I only said that I believe listeners have the freedom to
understand/interpret a song as they wish.  Therefore, we are arguing on the
same side Kyri :))

>You are making assumptions again. I'm certainly not homophobic.
>Assumptions, assumptions, assumptions.

>I certainly don't believe that. But then again the 'you' refers to a whole
>not any individual. Ergo, a generalisation is made. I hate
>generalisations..we're all so different from the other.
>Kyri

On the second part - 'generalisations', I think your problem is that you
didn't read my email properly.  I originally stated "some of you" to
indicate that I believe it is only a very small group of people who need to
lighten up on these issues.  I did use the word "you" later,  in the same
sentence, but I believe it is common sense in English to remember that I was
still referring to just "some of you".  

I must admit that you comments on 'assumptions' are very ambiguous, and
nearly the most bizarre thing I've read on an email list :)
- Firstly, *IF* you think I was referring to you, then I suggest you watch
what you type...in your 'add-on' to Lane's email you not only had to
"HAHAHAHA" (with no sign of it being a 'friendly giggle'), and you gave no
reason about your reply except to quickly point out that it was 'another
vote for missing the point'.  This in fact contradicts what you typed in
your last email.  Up the top of this text, there is your quote "yes
understand the song as you wish", and yet you're laughing at people for
"missing the point".  Make up your mind - you either believe in freedom of
interpretation or you don't!  Just because you don't have the same
interpretation (or Kate for that matter) doesn't justify telling people that
they are "missing the point".  
- Secondly, *IF* you think I was referring to some other people on the list,
then I still stand by my view that some here are homophobic.  If this is
what you meant, then your 'assumption' comment is very strange!!  Let me put
it this way...if someone says to you "Kyri, I feel that poster over there is
demeaning and sexist towards women because of the picture and words", do you
respond "Hmmm.  Assumptions, assumptions, assumptions!"?  Or if someone says
"I feel that person was fired because he/she is black", is the response also
"What an *assumption*!"?  Every opinion in the world perhaps contains some
type of assumption, in which case I wonder why you bothered saying that?!!
Isn't it innate in EVERY thing we decide that there might be an
assumption...but that doesn't stop us from having opinions.  If you consider
yourself a fair person Kyri, then perhaps you should tell *every* person,
when they make *any* comment, "Assumptions!!"  :))
        I agree that sometimes it is hard to tell if some comments are
homophobic (or sexist, racist etc.) or not, but I do genuinely believe that
due to the over-eagerness of people to stamp out any gay interpretation of
Cloudbusting, there is a subtle element of homophobia.  Some people's
comments - such as Lane's - are just ridiculous.  What Lane did was to type
a paragraph, in which he applied a rough concept that Kate had when she
wrote the song, and then added at the end "Oh, by the way, I'm gay".  I
agree with you Lane - that doesn't work for me either!!  But Lane and Kyri,
that is NOT a gay interpretation!!  You did a Kate interpretation adding
'gay' on the end - of course it sounds silly the way you wrote it!!  A gay
interpretation means the whole meaning is changed, not "Kate meaning + 1
sentence using the word 'gay'".  I still very often interpret the song as a
'gay son' story...where 'coming out' means coming out as openly gay, the
'yo-yo' refers to homosexuality (I certainly felt as a teenager that it was
special yet also dangerous in a way (because of rejection by others)), and
Cloudbusting refers to breaking homophobia - I still tingle when Kate
whispers: "Cloudbusting daddy".  It always makes me feel like she loves this
gay person very much, and she is pleading with the father of this gay son to
open his mind; it's like she knows that the gay son really loves his father,
and she doesn't want their relationship to cease.  (Kyri and Lane: even in
the 'gay interpretation' I personally feel like the father-son relationship
is *still* important.  At least something in common eh? :) ). 

Above all, after reading these posts, I guess the biggest emotion which has
surfaced, is not simply the fact that the song means something special to
each of us, but the fact that we *all* love Cloudbusting...I *assume* (grin
:) ) that Kate would love to know that the song is so important to us that
we spend weeks discussing and debating it :))

Thanks *again* for reading it everyone!! :)  (and yes Kyri, that's also an
assumption!! :))))
Kim