serious ecto notes from the ecto moderator

[jessica@athos.rutgers.edu (jessica)]

nrc@bsbbs.UUCP (N. Richard Caldwell) writes:

>I don't doubt that Jon would take issue with some of the things said
>about him in Ecto.  As long as the Ecto archives are publicly available,
>however, there is no reason that Jon should not have access to that 
>information, no matter how embarrassing it may be for Vickie to have
>her rude and insensitive remarks revealed.

I won't argue opinion, but since I disagree, i'll ask jon. Jon, did
you feel that mention of you in ecto was something said "about you" in
any kind of derogatory intionally slandering way? _I_ felt that people
were just discussing your review of Happy's music, and in a relatively
light-hearted way, too. It being a happy-music mailing list, the
discussion seemed to have come from discussing happy, not from
discussing you. 

>> I guess you failed to notice 
>> that Ecto is a large group of diverse people, with diverse opinions and 
>> that Ectophiles just seem to lack the childish need to be rude and 
>> interject sarcastic and cutting comments whenever someone says something 
>> they disagree with.

(Argh. I won't try to keep members of the mailing list from explaining
what the mailing list means and is to them. I'll just disagree. I
don't really like the way this is put, and I don't neccessarily
beleive it is true. I think most if not all of the ectophiles are
capable of being rude, capable of being childish, no more or less
human or superhuman than anyone anywhere else. I simply think that the
list has enough focus and enough good stuff to talk about that there's
never been a need or an impetus for people to show the weaker and/or
less pleasant sides of themselves. (expression of personal belief for
the qualification challenged. *grin*) aaaaaaaah but i should qualify
myself and not say never, but say _rarely_, and i'll explain that in
the next paragraph).

>While Ecto is indeed generally friendly and flame free, it is simply
>not correct to suggest that there are no rude, sarcastic or cutting
>remarks.  The difference is that when these remarks do occur they are
>often directed at those outside the group and generally without their
>knowledge.  It is thus no surprise that flame wars do not ensue.

Aaaaaaaaah. Look closely at what happened.

In the past week or so, beginning with the "warmroom" announcement and
the ensuing comparison to ecto, there's been a "discussion" (or call
it flame-war or argument or wahtever, there's been a series of
communication) that has to do with this very "warmroom/gaffa/ecto"
issue.

warmroom was created because gaffa got ugly and ecto had provided the 
source of inspiration for one love-hound (jorn) to create a mailing
list with that kind of atmosphere for talking about kate. *(see later note)

A "discussion" ensued, and it began on gaffa, moved to warmroom, and
partially because of the direct comparisons, partially because many
gaffa/warmroom people are also ecto people, part of the discussion
found itself on ecto. I was *not*, not at *all*, happy to see that.
But i've never wanted to or tried to direct what shoudl be discussed
on ecto, or how. The only rude, sarcastic, cutting, and in any way
unpleasant remarks that have ever been made on ecto have *only* been
made as a part of the "warmroom/gaffa/ecto" discussion. 

I do *not* consider that a true part of ecto - it's something that
spilled in from elsewhere. I don't argue that that does make it a part
of the list - and as i said, i *never* would beleive that the
ectophiles are incapable of such things. But I feel the need to point
out that it was not in any way the regular natural flow of ecto
discussion to turn to such remarks, they were all brought in from
another discussion that had little (but very little) to do with the
list and its topics at all.

*(the aforementioned later note). gaffa's history is pretty well
known. ecto began as a list to discuss happy rhodes as there was a lot
to discuss and many love-hounds were not interested. ecto became not
just a place to discuss happy rhodes, but also a very warm and
friendly environment. why? gosh, why not. the people have all just
been way cool, and there simply *is* a lot of ecto-material to talk
about. I never expected or intended it to be a "warm fuzzy blue"
mailing list. I've never kept anyone out, and though i had a problem
with ftp space for a while, the archives were always available if
requested, and are currently (and permanently) available.

*(aforementioned note part 2). jorn (and many others) want a place to
talk about kate that has that kind of atmosphere, so they're going to
try to force it, by letting in only those who want that atmosphere,
and exluding others. I don't have a problem with private
mailing lists - i don't consider it a form of censorship. but that
doesn't keep me from wondering if it'll be successful, and from
*knowing* that even if they do create the atmosphere they want, it
can't ever, and will never, be what the atmosphere on ecto is, because
the atmosphere on ecto happened naturally.

Gosh, i agree 100% with some recent postings - can this issue be
dropped? are there still people with driving problems with some
current situation? WHy don't we just let the ecto list, the warmroom
list, and the gaffa group(love-hounds list) go on, and see what happens.
My personal suggestion would be (i preach only what i practice, or
such is my attempt) to just be a part of the things you want to be,
and talk about the things that interest you with people who are
similarly interested. And let other people do the same.

			    jessica


-- 
|| jessica  || It is this that || Don't try to tell me there's no reason for ||
|| lawrence ||    brings us    || any moment in time, every memory of mine.  ||
|| koeppel  ||    together.    || Those years are lines of color on my face, ||
|| dembski  ||        --Kate   || the past is warpaint.     --Happy Rhodes   ||