sTuff - lots of it!

[the love that whirls <REWOICC%ERENJ.BITNET@mitvma.mit.edu>]

hey ho...

some informational background about the mythological meanings of the ninth
wave that i gleaned off of celtic-l in the past few days...i thought that
some of you might be interested (even if KaTe did not have any of this in
mind when she chose that title for the work, it is interesting to learn
some of the more interesting tidbits about what it meant in the mytholog-
ical context that t.h. white drew it from...).

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From:         Melcir Erskine-Richmond <USERNTCP@SFU>
Subject:      Taliesin's cryptic verses

Am aware we need to begin to look seriously at what Taliesin had in mind
when he wrote those marvellously cryptic phrases, such as the one Sarah
refers to in her reposted (HB HG HC letter) - about being made by the waters
of the 9th wave.  Well, Sarah, as I've said before, don't try to read
Taliesin or other bardic initiates literally!  They deliberated in bardic
code and you had to be in the know to know what was being said.  But this
9th wave one has been passed down exoterically - there is something special
about someone who captures that 9th wave - they are the 'special' ones, or
perhaps the geniuses.  This is what the comment meant - he comes of the
order of 9th wave genius.

Cheers - happy weekend
Melcir

From:         James Marchand <marchand@UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU>
Subject:      9 waves

Right you are Melcir.  You have to experience Taliesin, not read him.  But
Sarah is right to try to understand him.  Nine was, of course, a big number
with the Celts and the Germanics, Odhinn hung nine nights on the windy tree,
Niall experienced nine hostages, one could be the ninth son of nine mothers,
nine chariots were according to the custom of the gods, one had nine pipers,
etc.  The ninth wave was important and magical, as Melcir points out.  Morann,
son of Carbery Cat Head was born with a blemish, but it was washed away by
letting nine waves wash over him, the ninth taking away the blemish.  The
learned say that a plague goes no further than nine waves.  When the Milesians
invaded, the Tuatha De Danannans made them go out past 9 waves, so that the
magic of the TDD's returned.  Even in the law-books, if something washed out
to sea past the 9th wave it was fair salvage.  Witter, witter.  Nine waves
was a big deal.  Watch out for the nine arrows of the witch!
Jim Marchand

From:         cdwright@UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU
Subject:      Re: Taliesin's cryptic verses

The ninth wave as a unit of measurement is common in Irish sources; I've
never had a reason to collect examples, but some references are in Rees and
Rees, Celtic Heritage, p. 194 (they say that the ninth wave was "larger and
more fortunate than the rest").  Another ex. is in T. P. Cross and Slover,
Ancient Irish Tales, p. 18.

Charlie Wright

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woj again...i see some parallels between the concept of the ninth wave
and the idea of the seventh son of a seventh son. i just wonder why the
number nine is associated with water and seven with parentage. but that
is not a matter related to KaTe, so i shall heave to...

...and continue not to talk about KaTe. i too have heard the new innocence
mission album, _umbrella_, and after three or four listens like it very
much. those of you who fear the sophomore blues needn't worry (too much).
the songs are still very much in their style - soft and intimate - but i
swear that robin guthrie possessed the body of don peris for the guitar
sounds...shades of the etheriel blissrock guitars of cocteau twins abound
here and there in the music and karen's voice is wonderful as ever. it
didn't grab me at first like their debut did - this is more of a web that
emeshes you within rather than the bear trap that snaps you up - but that
subtlety is wonderful.

hmm...KaTesTuff? hmmm...ah...she really is!

but on a more serious note, i was reading through some back issues of
homeground this past weekend and, though it's obvious why, was struck by
the differences between a KaTezine and love-hounds. where we discuss, a
'zine muses...longish articles written by readers about what a song means
to *them* or just KaTe-inspired prose (such as krys' in homeground). the
basic reason, of course, is cos love-hounds, due to its structure as a
newsgroup and mailing list and due to the speed of electronic communica-
tion ("megs of bytes screaming down t2 trunks" as someone put it last week
in one of the admin groups), lends itself to be a discussion forum. still,
i wonder what it would be like if we saw more of that "other stuff" here.

hmmm...now if i only had more time (anybody want to lend me a few hours of
their day?).
--
woj -- woj@remus.rtugers.edu -- rewoicc@erenj.bitnet -- zengineer/dj for hire
 the pleasure of the aching void: fegmaniax-request@pebbles.sct.clarkson.edu
            in the beginning was the fish and the fish was good