A random discussion about "The Dreaming"

[Doug Alan <nessus>]

I changed how the mailing list works a little bit, and I want to test it
out.  So here's a couple of messages from a mail conversation I had
recently with Jeff Richardson:

From: ihnp4!utzoo!dciem!jeff
Date: 14 Aug 85 13:23:31 CDT (Wed)
Subject: Re:  A Deal With God

A couple of things you said in your last mail to me reminded me of something
I noticed about "The Dreaming".  You said the British press called it over-
produced, incomprehensible, complicated and confused.  Aside from the fact
that I think it's almost impossible to over-produce a piece of music (I've
been told that Peter Gabriel thought that Bob Ezrin over-produced his first
album, but I think that the lavish production on the album sounds great.
On the other hand, the much less produced versions of "Here Comes The Flood"
on Robert Fripp's "Exposure" album and the German version are also great,
and I consider all three essential parts of my music collection.),
I can understand them saying that because it does take a lot of
concentration to appreciate the album (but that's why I like it).
Another point you brought up is that you would be a Kate Bush fan even
if she didn't make music.  My question is, "would you be a Kate Bush fan if
she didn't sing?"  You may not agree, but it seems to me that even though
"The Dreaming" is complicated, layered, and all that other great stuff, if
you took away the vocals, on most of the songs you wouldn't be left with
very much; the music does not stand on its own.  I find it really amazing
that she was able to do such an interesting, complex, layered album without
using very much music, since most people rely on the music for those things.
However, since she can do with very little music what most other artists
have trouble doing even with lots of music, I think she could do even better
(I know you don't agree with that) if she used more music, because the parts
of the album where she uses the most music tend to be my favourites.  If the
Planxty (sp?) people are "all over" the new album, I think that could be an
encouraging sign, because the amount they're used on "Night Of The Swallow"
is just a tease.  It leaves me wanting more.  Speaking of which, I must admit
that I know very little about British and Irish folk, other than the instruments
that are used, so it's very possible for a song to have British or Irish folk
influences and for me not to even notice them unless the traditional instruments
are used, so if you say "Running Up That Hill" is folk influenced, I'll
believe you.

Jeff Richardson


>From nessus Fri Aug 16 03:14:35 1985
Subject: Re:  A Deal With God

> I can understand them saying that because it does take a lot of
> concentration to appreciate the album (but that's why I like it).

They shouldn't be music critics, though, if they're not willing to
listen.  And apparently, they rarely do....

> Another point you brought up is that you would be a Kate Bush fan even
> if she didn't make music.  My question is, "would you be a Kate Bush fan if
> she didn't sing?"

I don't know what you mean.  I'd be a Kate Bush fan if she was just a
poet who wrote her words down on paper, and there was nothing to listen
to at all.  Her poetry is just that good!  It's difficult to imagine
what Kate's music would be like if she hadn't been born with or
developed such a wonderful voice.  I'm sure she would have found some
other nearly as good way of expressing herself though.

Or are you saying "Would I be a Kate Bush fan if she didn't have any
lyrics?"?  I certainly would be!  It's the music that caught my
attention first, not the lyrics.

> You may not agree, but it seems to me that even though "The Dreaming"
> is complicated, layered, and all that other great stuff, if you took
> away the vocals, on most of the songs you wouldn't be left with very
> much; the music does not stand on its own.

I'm not sure what you mean here either.  The vocals are part of the
music.  You could replace Kate's vocals with a non-vocal instrument and
still get something great, I'm sure.

Have you ever heard the instrumental version of "The Dreaming".  All of
the lead vocals are missing.  The digerido is missing.  Some of the
background vocals are missing, but some are left in.  It's still
amazingly great.  I like it as much as the album version!

Also, there are all sorts of non-vocal instrumentals that are just
stunningly great.  The guitar in "Pull Out The Pin"!  The digerido in
"The Dreaming"!  Eberhard Weber's bass in "Houdini" and the violins!
The Planxty stuff in "Night of the Swallow", etc., etc.!

> I find it really amazing that she was able to do such an interesting,
> complex, layered album without using very much music, since most
> people rely on the music for those things.

What's all the complexity, if it isn't music?  I think that there's more
music crammed into all the layers of "The Dreaming" than on any ten
normal albums!  Sometimes when I listen to "The Dreaming", I ignore the
vocals, and just listen to the background stuff.  Even then there's too
much to be able to absorb it all.  Paying attention to just one
instrument can be really neat, or the interplay between just two.

> However, since she can do with very little music what most other artists
> have trouble doing even with lots of music, I think she could do even better
> (I know you don't agree with that) if she used more music, because the parts
> of the album where she uses the most music tend to be my favourites.

Which parts are those?

> If the Planxty (sp?) people are "all over" the new album, I think that
> could be an encouraging sign, because the amount they're used on
> "Night Of The Swallow" is just a tease.  It leaves me wanting more.

Just a tease???  Oh those fiddles and whistles and pipes and bouzouki in
the choruses and in the instrumental at the beginning!  They're just so
great!  It makes me quiver just thinking about it.

> Speaking of which, I must admit that I know very little about British
> and Irish folk, other than the instruments that are used, so it's very
> possible for a song to have British or Irish folk influences and for
> me not to even notice them unless the traditional instruments are
> used, so if you say "Running Up That Hill" is folk influenced, I'll
> believe you.

I don't know much about British or Irish folk music either -- it just
sounds that way to me (just the melody).

			-Doug