...and still the debate KonTinues...

[IED0DXM%UCLAMVS.BITNET@WISCVM.WISC.EDU]

IED is happy to see that he is not the only L-H to describe
himself oddly -- all hail |>oug.

>U.S. release dates are different thant British release dates.  In
>England the release date is when you can find it in the stores.  In
>the U.S., it's when it goes to the distributors, so you basically have
>to add about a week until you can actually get it.

This may be the general rule on the east coast, but it certainly is
not in Los Angeles. A domestic LP or single release usually appears
on or before the official "release" date here. Very often, in fact,
promotional copies find their way into used record bins here several
days before the LP is to be officially introduced to the record-buying
public.

My experience in London was that the release date there was also
"late" -- at least two records scheduled for "release" on a Monday
actually arrived at the Virgin Oxford Street Megastore the Friday
before.

>Well sometimes inspired rhapsodies are better than the original.  The
>12-inch version is more varied and less commercial.  The 12-inch
>single provides an oportunity for Kate do something more interesting
>than she might otherwise be able to considering the limitations placed
>on her by the expectations of the public and her record company for a
>7-inch single.

IED does not believe that Kate is altering her art to meet the
expectations of the public and her record company. Rather, she
has developed a taste for the formats of her time, i.e. she LIKES
the variety of mixes now possible with the proliferation of
twelve-inch single releases. It's not a question of her feeling
that one is a constraining and the other a liberating force upon her
creative impulse. They offer DIFFERENT possibilities to her, but
one is not "better" than the other. Again, apples and oranges, Doug.

>And what's wrong with Klaus Schulze!  Klaus Schulze has made a couple
>of |>oug's very favorite albums.  And Kate herself has said that when
>she listens to albums these days, it's mostly ECM or Windom Hill.

It's Windham, not Windom. The latter is a character actor on
"Murder She Wrote". Anyway, IED didn't say there was anything
wrong with Klaus Schulze, only that likening his music to
the most important human creation in the history of life, the
universe and everything did not serve Schulze well.

>The 7-inch version, however has relegated this magnificent beam of
>unearthly radiance to a mere 3-second bit part buried in the mix.

More like a minute all told, actually. Actually, however,
IED sympathizes with your view, but does not exactly share it.
True, the introductory string passage of the twelve-inch mix is
an utterly entrancing melodic invention unlike anything Kate has
created before. But having become familiar with it, IED feels that its
function as a kind of subliminal descant in the seven-inch version serves
as a prime example of the kind of "profundity in detail" that KT
fanatics try to demonstrate to the uninitiated as proof of her
supremacy among contemporary musicians. Certainly it's
beautiful by itself, but it also contributes greatly to the
seven-inch version as a sotto voce enhancement of the main
musical information. This is a good example of why Kate succeeds
so well with both the seven-inch and the twelve-inch formats: she alters
the function of her music to optimize the variety of presentation.
IED thinks it's NEAT that Kate can think up a bit of music as sublime
as that string passage, only to "bury it" deep within the nether
regions of "Experiment IV"'s seven-inch mix. No other musician
is talented enough or confident enough to do something like that.

>|>oug never said that Kate tries to look like a sex kitten.  He said
>that the cover makes it look like Kate is trying to look like a sex
>kitten.  Such a characteristic, however, can just as often be the
>statement of the photographer rather than the subject.  |>oug thinks,
>though, that it is unarguable that at times Kate tries to appear
>erotic.  And there's nothing wrong with that as long as the eroticism
>is a vehicle for an artistic message.  The cover of X4 certainly seems
>to be trying to make Kate look glamorous, but |>oug finds little of
>artistic worth in the photograph.

OK, this is basically acceptable. IED agrees that the "Experiment IV"
cover is very low on artistic interest, although he still sees no
more than the most nominal erotic content in it. The problem with it
is that it conveys no complexity of meaning or detail: it's bland,
unrealistic and unenlightening, despite Kate's interesting expression.
In IED's opinion, the BACK cover photograph is far more intriguing.
Ostensibly just a picture of the studio backdrop used for the front
cover photo, it might also be intended to hint at some infernal
scientific goings-on behind the tarpaulin...

|>oug agrees that {the front cover photograph of Hounds of Love}
has its merits.  The dogs, hinting at bestiality,
are nice, but if they weren't there, admit it, it would look like a
cosmetics ad.  The "Ninth Wave" cover is far far superior.

Insofar as any photography
can have artistic worth (it remains a suspect medium, in IED's opinion),
the HoL cover is of high value. But IED probably has quite different
criteria for judging the artistic merit of visual imagery than |>oug.
That's okay by IED. By the way, for evidence of the sophistication
of John Carder Bush's aesthetic sense and technical knowhow, L-Hs
should take note of (and shell out notes for) his book of photos
of Kate as an eight-year-old girl (entitled "Cathy"), all taken
when he was twenty-two (twenty years ago). Clear signs of his
debt to, awareness of, and innovations on the traditions created
by so-called Pre-Raphaelite and Arts and Crafts Movement photographers,
notably R. Spence, Mrs. Cameron, and Charles Dodgson (Lewis Carroll).
IED thinks it is an extremely fine and touching collection of pictures.

>>But in all cases where the "sex kitten" has been seen, the
>>interpretation has revealed far more about the viewer than about the
>>subject.

>Yeah.  That |>oug thinks Kate can do better than try to sell her
>records on sex-appeal.

This is a tautology. The issue is whether Kate IS "trying to sell
her records on sex-appeal". Since, in IED's opinion, there is no
demonstrable evidence that she is, he points
out that those who see in these photographs support for the
notion that she is, are apparently transferring -- whether consciously
or not -- their own skein of sexual associations onto the imagery.

>>The Japanese cover for The Kick Inside!? This is Doug's idea of
>>"glamour"? You are using the term "glamour photography" in its
>>lowest, contemporary sense, as a sleazy form of girlie photography,
>>apparently.

>Is IED saying that there are photos of Kate that look like sleazy
>girlie photos?  |>oug thinks that such interpretations say far more
>about the viewer than about the subject.

Touche, more or less. As a matter of fact, IED does think the
pink leotard shots are the closest to sleaze -- or at any
rate the most manipulative of Kate -- of any of her official
promotional photos. Certainly that is the reputation that
they have acquired. On the other hand, her expression in those
shots is fine and subtle. It is highly significant, IED would like
to add, that the pink leotard photo which appears on The Whole Story
LP has been almost prudishly cropped. Kate's influence over
the promotion of her image has clearly grown since 1978.

>|>oug has seen much more inspiring body calligraphy type photographs
>elsewhere.  The RutH body calligrpahy photographs are okay, but they
>seem kind of pretentious and |>oug thinks they would work better if
>the calligraphy were just removed.

OK. A simple matter of opinion. IED feels that the calligraphy
allows more room for possible interpretation, provides more incidental
detail and creates a fascinating atmosphere of unreality to the image,
and consequently to the music, as well.

>>THIS IS TERRIBLE! IED shipped Peter a boatload of cash over there
>>for one of those damn shirts. Now what'll he do?

>Doug supposes he will have to ship IED's boat back.

NO!!!!
He refuses to accept this!
Maybe Peter and Dave will order
a whole bunch more shirts...
maybe they had already set IED's
aside before the party...maybe
they'll recover the stolen shirts...
oh, no-o-o-o-o-o-o-o......

>>>Other random news: Kate is doing the title song for a movie called
>>>"Castaways", which will be released early next year.

>>Could you please give any further information that you might have
>>about this unexpected and exciting development? Thanks.

>IED knows as much as |>oug.

Then let |> re-invoke his miraculous modern technological
soundwave transporter to find out more, please...